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[Debbie.nl.ca]

Remember Dakotas heat stroke, well it happened again. Not as severe but he collapsed again.
Back to the books, namely "the Joy of" and was reading page 30 "Hypoglycemia" and "melting"
That was just what it was like, he was melting away.
Same scenario, long run and she just had another heat.
He's all by himself now, and for good.
Now I guess as a complication to what ever is wrong with him,"these spells", he's now having teeth troubles and had to have a trim.
Tell me all you know about diabetes in chins please.
It's not looking good for my big boy.

[Joyce]

Debbie,

So sorry to hear this.  I have 2 beige sisters that are hypoglycemic.  They are rescues and both have hypoglycemia seizures.  This condition is LOW blood sugar, not diabetes for us.  I have never had a chin that was diabetic.  Lani helped us out alot when the girls started having seizures now we know how to control them and what to do.  I need to keep sugar in their systems especially when they are awake at night and most active, playing etc.  They each get a few dried papaya cubes every night.  I keep a plastic dropper and syringe on hand along with Smuckers bluberry syrup and strawberry syrup.  When seizures have popped up during the night we give them a drop of syrup at a time on their mouth when the seizures calm down (in between episodes).  They are usually doing much better in not too long a time.
Ask your vet about this because this works for us but may not for someone elses animal.  Each chin is different.  It took forever to finally diagnose them,  for a while we thought it was calcium fits.  Look on Lani's website, she has alot on seizures.  She is an excellent person to talk to about this!
I hope I have made sense, just getting over a migraine tonight.  :-[

[Debbie.nl.ca]

Thanks Joyce, so no other treatment?
How long have yours lived with it now?
I gave him honey, and they all get a piece of papaya just about every day.
He's fine as long as he's not running around hard.
The teeth problem is sure complicating things now, he can't chew anything.He's down to 750 grams from1000.
He's a real timid one too, stresses easy.
I'll soon have seen it all

[Jo Ann]

Hi Debbie,
    I sent you an e-mail on part of your question.
    If he does pretty good except when he is running hard, what about short exercise periods and maybe build him a maze or multi cubby hole set-up with different things to play with in each to occupy his attention.
    I also forgot to mention in the e-mail about putting alfalfa (because it's richer) hay, senior equine, your chinchilla pellets, calf manna, chewable vitamin C tablets and dried papaya in your blender or food processor to get them to a powder form, then add some raw wheat germ (found at most health food stores), put in an air-tight jar and refrigerate.  I make a few football/basket ball or kisses-shaped chin-sized treats made with the powder and a small amount of Nutri-Cal (found in the cat/dog section of the pet store) and keep them in an air-tight container in the refrigerator and I give Toofie one a couple times a day. (Toofie is my chin born with only two teeth ... they have to be trimmed weekly.)

 
Jo Ann

P.S. And like Joyce said ... Check with Lani at California Chins.

[Joyce]

   Hi Debbie,  I just wrote a long reply to your post and as soon as I was done and ready to send it.......I got signed off!!!!!!!!!! Lost it all.  Gotta love computers huh?  I will re write & post after I take a little break here.  If you want to PM me your phone number I will be more than happy to call you and chat about it!  Just let me know what our time difference is so I don't wake you up at 3 AM.  I am Eastern time here.  It is 1:20 PM in the afternoon now.

[Debbie.nl.ca]

I've done that Joyce, it takes me too long and I run out of time.

I'm trying it all Lady's, and will have to bring him back next week for another trim. The vet thinks it could take a few in a row to get him chewing again.
He did throw the alfalfa hay around his cage, but I'm not sure how much got into him.
I just went down with 2 kinds of baby food, and some yogurt,he wouldn't touch it.
He tries to chew a pellet or two of calf manna, and I find his papaya in tiny pieces on the floor.Maybe some is getting into him.
Anything you can think of I will try.

[Joyce]

 :-[  Hi Debbie,

OK, let us try this again!
We got the beige girls when they were babies.  When they were about 1 year old and within a couple months of eachother they began having seizures.  They have lived with them for about 2 years now.  The seizure episodes happened mostly when they were out for playtime at night.  The exercise/play and running wore them out and used up all the glucose in their systems lowering their blood sugar and making them hypoglycemic.  It was so pathetic holding them and watching them convulsing.  We called Lani Ritchie several times when they would have an episode, as they were actually having a seizure.  One of the first questions I remember Lani asking us was "Are they beiges"!!!  "Yes", I said, and almost fel off the couch, how did she know?  Lani said beiges are more prone to seizures. Shedid also mention another color but I can't remember.  Or she may have said that chins that have seizures are alot of the time are beiges.
Nope, no other treatment has ever been needed.  I just give them the papaya cubes every night and sometimes in the day when they are awake I slip them another.  They are in a huge multi level cage with a 15" Chin Spin so they get plenty of exercise, but we DO NOT let them out to run around anymore outside the cage.  They only come out to climb on our arms and get lovies, and be held.
These are 2 big girls too!  Magoo weighs 965 grams and Pussy Willow is right behind her!
It is always scary when they have a seizure but I just remain calm, give them drops of sweet syrup on their mouth.  We keep them with us but try not to handle them too much because the ears
are uslly red and they overheat.  I get a cool stone from the freezer to rest them on if needed.   feel it gets bad enough we would rush them to the emergency hospital so they could be treated with anticonvulsants.  I guess that is what they give them?  Lani told me but I forget.  They would know what to do at the hospital though and Mike would too.
I can relate to these 2 girls because I myself am hypoglycemic and also have a seizure disorder!  Funny coincendence huh?
Sorry about all of the typos but my computer is acting up and if I try to correct the spelling or mess ups they get worse on me!!!

[Lori Earle]

Deb,
Seems like there could be a relationship between the dental problems and the seizures. Like - perhaps Dakota is more susceptible to hypoglycemia since he's not getting all the nutrients/calories that he needs? The low blood sugar factor sounds pretty treatable with papaya or fruit syrup. (my vet suggested corn syrup, tho the fruit syrup sounds healthier and tastier).
Regarding his difficulty in eating. Here's something to try, which has helped me with my chins when they're ill or having dental problems. Take a clean coffee grinder and fill to the top with alfalfa leaf(weed out the stems). Grind til it's pulverized to a powder(takes maybe 2 minutes, seems like forever!). Put it in a bowl, then grind up the same amount of oats(i.e. a coffee grinder full) to a powder. Mix the alfalfa powder with the oat powder. Take 2 teaspoons of this and mix with water til it's a syringe-able liquid. My chins love this stuff big time. I also add a 1/4 tsp nutritional shake mix to beef it up - that's optional, but very helpful to a sick chin.  This alfalfa/oat mix would only be a no-no if a chin was not used to alfalfa - if they're only eating timmy hay, it could be too rich.
Just a thought, let me know if you try it...
Take care,
Lori

[Debbie.nl.ca]

Gee Joyce That's interesting, as Dakota is a beige too.
Yes indeed the book says the ruby- eyed chins maybe prone.
I have read it a 100 times and still find new info in it." the Joy of chinchillas"
I don't mind the seizures, they don't upset me. I have one that's 7 and has had seizures since a head injury a few days after birth.
Dakotas are so different, as he does just melt in my arms. like he's dieing.

Yes Lori I'll try him with tonight. He loves his alfalfa, and the only thing I can see he even tries. I'll let you know

[Debbie.nl.ca]

Lori he ate it
I had to put it threw a tea strainer after the blender, still had some sticks in the alfalfa.
I used the homemade pediolit as the water, and had to add more as it would clog. But once I worked out the right consistency for him, I just held a small pointed nuzzled bottle up to the cage and he sucked his fill.
He's in a bit of a mess, but has something in his stomach now.
I'll keep you guys posted, and thank you all so very much.
Every chin is so different it takes a lot of trying this and that to find what works for each one that gets sick.
Many heads are better than one!

I need a group hug here!

[Joyce]

 

[Jo Ann]

  Great!   
   Keep us posted!

 

Jo Ann

[Debbie.nl.ca]

Dakota had another trim yesterday.
No spurs or points, just his incisors too long.
The vet is concerned that his roots seem to bumping in the bottom of jaw so quickly.
He has brought in the critical care, but Dakota didn't like it. I'll have to get the berry flavored and try that.
He seems to try anything for a day or so, the turns up his nose.
He was fretting so bad I put him back with his cage mate, and he does try to nibble some with her.I saw him eating oatmeal last night, and I do see him at the food dish through out the day.
His weight is dropping still and he's just under 700 grams now.
For the low sugars he said just to keep corn syrup on hand.
It's the complications from it that's harder to treat.
Being a tov homo beige isn't helping he said. On the rarer side of ruby eyed chins and could even have more complications because he's such a stressed out type.
He was my biggest bestest I bred here.
Sure goes to show you eh!