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[Abby W.]

My black velvet female is full term in her pregnancy, and she has seemed to be in active labor a couple of times over the past week or so.  Last week she actually bled a little, but still no babies.  I took her to the  vet today and we found a kind of gooey brownish discharge coming fom her vaginal area.  The vet was not sure but felt that she was experiencing a fetal re-absorption, but without an unltrasound she couldn't be sure.  She listened for the kit's heartbeat but was unable to hear anything.  We put her on antibiotics as a precaution, but I was holding her earlier and think I felt some kind movement.  Does anyone have any idea what is going on???  Is it just wishful thinking that she may still have a live kit?  She is continuing to act like an expectant mother, laying on her side and stretching a lot, cleaning her vaginal area frequently, etc.  If she does have a live kit still could the antibiotics hurt it?  Should I wait to administer them?  Help!!! 

[Debbie.nl.ca]

A chin can carry for 120, so how far along is full term? How many days now?
 The brownish discharge is not good, but they have two uterus, so ya never know there could be one alive. I would think the vet would hear, but if he's not used to treating chins???
She will have to deliver what ever is left. If she's had a missed abortion, and is trying to reabsorb a fetus that is too big already, she will have to expell something soon.
I haven't had such a problem and hope others may be able to shed some light for you.
I would say make sure she's is drinking and eating, and wait, something has to happen, and I'm so hoping for the best for you both.
 

[Abby W.]

Unfortunately, I don't know her conception date, but she is showing all the signs of a female about to deliver, and she is as big as a house.  Plus I definitely felt movement as early as two weeks ago, so I would assume she would be close by now.  I have been reading about superfoetation, is it possible for this to occur and then one of the fertiulized eggs to abort or undergo reabsorption while the other continues to develop properly?  I was just checking her again and I am 99% sure I felt movement in her belly.  Whatever is going on I wish she would hurry up and get on with it so I know what's happening!   

[Jo Ann]

Hi Abby,

My black velvet female is full term in her pregnancy, and she has seemed to be in active labor a couple of times over the past week or so.  Last week she actually bled a little, but still no babies.  I took her to the  vet today and we found a kind of gooey brownish discharge coming fom her vaginal area.  The vet was not sure but felt that she was experiencing a fetal re-absorption, but without an unltrasound she couldn't be sure.  She listened for the kit's heartbeat but was unable to hear anything. 

       Isn't this the same black velvet that you called me about that went into active labor on August 6th?  I strongly suggested then, that if she did not deliver within 24 hours to have the vet check her out.  And that if you saw any evidence of blood to take her in immediately and do what ever was necessary for her.

       Did you have her do the ultrasound?
     
     Abby, to be truthful, it sounds to me like you have already lost at least one kit, maybe more and will most likely loose the momma, too.   I wish you had taken my advice on August 7th.   

 
Jo Ann [/i]

[Abby W.]

Well, she did not go into labor at all after I spoke with you.  She continued to eat and drink well, and have normal poops.  She did not seem in distress at all.  I did contact my vet by phone and she did say that she didn't feel I needed to bring Rebekkah in unless she seemed uncomfortable, was running a fever, or had changed her eating habits.  Unfortunately, my vet does not have an ultrasound machine, and I don't know of a vet who does and would be willing to see a chin...
Rebekkah still seems to feel fine.  I started her on antibiotics yesterday, and I have added acidophilus to her diet as well (several hours after the antibiotics, of course).  And I felt movement again this morning, so I have to believe she has a live kit in there still.  The vet did perform "a mini gynecological exam" and was able to observe the cervix open.  So whatever she is going to deliver it should be soon.  I hate to have a surgical procedure done if it's not necessary and would rather let nature take its course.  Of course, if at any time Rebekkah seems like she is not feeling well or changes her behavior patterns I will do whatever needs to be done.

[Jo Ann]

Good luck.   :-[

Is this an exotic pet vet?  Is she familiar with taking care of chinchillas?

The brownish discharge is not good, but they have two uterus, so ya never know there could be one alive. I would think the vet would hear, but if he's not used to treating chins???
She will have to deliver what ever is left. If she's had a missed abortion, and is trying to reabsorb a fetus that is too big already, she will have to expell something soon...

I agree with Debbie, the full-term-dead kit is to big to absorb and she will have to expell something soon ... bones and fur do not absorb quickly ... if the kit has been dead a week or two and it was even close to full term, there is a mass of bones, fur and muscle attempting to be absorbed.  Hopefully she can successfully expell them.

... she has seemed to be in active labor a couple of times over the past week or so. Last week she actually bled a little, but still no babies. I took her to the vet today and we found a kind of gooey brownish discharge coming fom her vaginal area. The vet was not sure but felt that she was experiencing a fetal re-absorption, but without an unltrasound she couldn't be sure...

Did she offer to do an x-ray to see if there is a second kit?  I hope the remains of the dead kit are not blocking the horn or the second kit (the one you say you can feel still moving) will be blocked and drown in it's own fluid.   

I have been reading about superfoetation, is it possible for this to occur and then one of the fertiulized eggs to abort or undergo reabsorption while the other continues to develop properly?  I was just checking her again and I am 99% sure I felt movement in her belly.  Whatever is going on I wish she would hurry up and get on with it so I know what's happening!   

The only cases of superfoetation I am familiar with, once the contractions start and the full term kit is delivered, each and every time, the preemie kit is also delivered at the same time.  The labor and delivery are hard on both mother and kit.  Since she has been in and out of it at least a couple of times, I would not want to lay odds on a healthy delivery for mother or kit.  But, with mother nature anything is possible, even if it is not probable.
 

How old is this black velvet?

 
Jo Ann [/i]

[Abby W.]

The black velvet female is about 16 months old, born in April 2005.  The vet does have experience dealing with chinchillas, she is a veterinarian specializing in exotics.  Unfortunately the clinic is a fairly small one and so they don't have some of the more expensive technology available at larger clinics.  She did not originally ask for an X-ray but after consulting some of her own colleagues did call me back after the appt and ask me to come in to have one done if Rebekkah has any further trouble or fails to deliver something within the next 24 hours, which I will definitely do.  I am keeping a VERY close eye on her (she is probably getting tired of the lack of privacy).  All I can do for now I guess is keep my fingers crossed that mother nature will come through for us...

[Debbie.nl.ca]

I have seen one deliver 2 healthy kits followed by a cocooned remains of one.
I have my fingers crossed, mother nature is amazing.

[Jo Ann]

Hi Abby,

She did not originally ask for an X-ray but after consulting some of her own colleagues did call me back after the appt and ask me to come in to have one done if Rebekkah has any further trouble or fails to deliver something within the next 24 hours, which I will definitely do.

   We'll be keeping our fingers crossed and waiting till tomorrow to see which way it all goes ... looks like it is down to a 24 hour count down!   :-[


Hi Debbie,

   Glad to hear someone has see it happen ... now I feel a little more hopeful.   

    Was the cocooned remains smaller or larger than the delivered kits?  Do you know if it contained bones still intact sufficient to have been carried during the same time, or could it have been from a completely previous pregnancy?

 
Jo Ann[/i]

[Debbie.nl.ca]

   Was the cocooned remains smaller or larger than the delivered kits?  Do you know if it contained bones still intact sufficient to have been carried during the same time, or could it have been from a completely previous pregnancy?

It was just a clump of fur and bones, but you could see the shape of the kit and even little arms and hands.
 A solid mass though, just kind of empty. Seemed as though all the internals were absorbed, and the fur and bones expelled in a wrap.
The dame just left it in a corner, while she tended to the 2 kits.

Oh and yes much smaller, weighed 24 grams, the kits were both 50.

[Abby W.]

Wow, that is pretty scary!  I am a nervous wreck and watching her like a hawk.      If nothing happens overnight I am going to take her for that x-ray tomorrow morning.  I am really hoping she does not need surgery or anything.  I would hate to see her go through that and I know it can be really dangerous for chins!  I am encouraged though that you have seen it happen with a relatively happy ending though, Debbie.  Thanks for the hope! 

[Jo Ann]

Hi Debbie,

   That almost sounds like a previous pregnancy that failed to deliver or abort, with the formed bones, limbs and fur still there and the internal organs gone.  But, it could have been superfoetation, I guess ... that would be a good one to check with CA Chins about.  The weight of the fur and bones being about 1/2 what each of the other two kits weighed almost sounds like it could have been bigger than they were, had it lived. 
    The cocoon, was it like a birth sack or just the fur swirled around the bones? Any fluid inside the cocoon?  Sorry, folks, if this sounds gross, I'm wanting to learn about something I have never seen, but may see and want to know what it is, if it happens to one of mine, or to some one else's if they e-mail me with a similar problem.

Abby, we'll be watching for the results!  I hope things work out for Rebekkah.

 
Jo Ann

[Summer]

That's OK It is good to learn new stuff!   

[outbackchin]

Abby, I really hope that everything goes well.  Are you still using the vets in Vienna?  If so, you and I know they will do everything possible to help Rebekkah get through whatever she is going through.  Lots of positive vibes sent your way!

[chinchillagrl06]

I have seen one deliver 2 healthy kits followed by a cocooned remains of one.
I have my fingers crossed, mother nature is amazing.

I believe Susan from AZChins had a rescue mother deliever 6 live babies and 1 mummified. I'll have to go search for the link. Mother nature is amazing. 

http://www.chinsandgliders.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=8548&hl=7+babies

Found the link.